Friday, April 14, 2017

What is 'greening out' and an it have long-term effects?

"I was reading one of your articles online about 'greening out' or what happens when you smoke too much weed. I am overseas and have no health coverage and don't know how I can get this question answered. Long story short I had never smoked weed and decided to try it. I took two hits of a bong and greened out. Experienced nausea, anxiety, cotton mouth and a loss of time. Things such as looking around became strange as well and my body felt light and different. Safe to say it was the first and last time. That was three months ago. I do have this fear that I have 'destroyed' my brain as a result of this or caused some sort of permanent damage. Is that a known side effect? It really is giving me great anxiety ..."

To be honest it sounds as though you simply experienced a cannabis 'high' rather than actually 'greening out'! Many people who experiment with any drug, but particularly cannabis, are not completely prepared for the experience and when the drug starts to have an effect it is not as they expected. They then try to fight the feeling and this results in anxiety and panic. That's what this sounds like ... This is why so many people try cannabis once, find out that it doesn't agree with them and choose to never use it again.

'Greening out' (also known as 'whiting out') is often described as a 'cannabis overdose' and is a term used to describe a situation where a person feels sick after smoking cannabis. They go pale (turning 'green' or 'white') and start to sweat; they feel dizzy and nauseous, and may even start vomiting. The experience can be quite frightening and users can become very anxious and start to panic. In extreme cases, the person may experience prolonged vomiting and even hallucinations. Cannabis users often report that the only way they can alleviate these symptoms is to lie down.

Greening out is much more likely to occur if the user has been drinking alcohol before they start smoking. Research evidence shows that because there is alcohol in the bloodstream, the THC (the part of cannabis that gets you stoned) is absorbed much faster. This can result in a much stronger and often far more unpleasant effect than usual. First-time cannabis users can often report similar experiences, although not quite so extreme (but still feeling very unpleasant nevertheless) - they just weren't prepared for the effects of the drug.

This can be a traumatic experience, whether you were on your own or if it happened at a party or gathering with other people around, and it can take some time for a person to recover. Have you 'destroyed' your brain or caused some permanent damage as a result of this 'one-time' experimentation? That is highly unlikely. As I said in a previous posting 'Can smoking weed once have a lasting effect?'you would have to be incredibly unlucky for this to happen as it appears to be regular use that causes the greatest problems. That said, a one-time use can lead to a terrifying experience, usually associated with anxiety or a panic attack, and it may be something you never forget!


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Jane Examines the Contrast of Abuse

Jane has an extensive look at abuse, including grooming, and the contrast with consanguinamory. Go read it.

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Wednesday, April 12, 2017

Discussing Consanguinamory


Consanguinamorous relationships are often ignorantly dismissed as dysfunctional, sick, or abusive, and sometimes the "incest" discussions found at porn sites do little to dispel that impression. However, and Kindred Spirits forum, which is NOT a porn forum, the discussions are sincere and reflect how real, beautiful, and in many ways, "normal" consanguinamorous relationships can be.

For example, here's a woman describing her relationship that was initiated through reunion reunion Genetic Sexual Attraction...
For [us] the most important things are the respect that we have for each other and remembering to always listen. [He] is my best friend, my partner and my lover. We have often wondered if the reason the sex is so good was because of the brother/sister element. We decided that we just fit together perfectly for what ever reason. Being non judgemental of each others desires and taking time to learn about what we both need.
He walks in the door after work and we are both just happy to be in each others company again especially knowing that we would give almost everything up to protect what we have.
Why would anyone want to kill such love? Why should they have to hide? Why shouldn't they be free to be open about their love and, if they want, to marry? There's no good reason.

If you want to discuss consanguinamory (consensual incest), I know of no better forum than Kindred Spirits, which is free. But if you join, be sure to immediately read and follow all of the rules. If you are a Friend of Lily, it can be very helpful to join with others to discuss life in general, as well as the love you have or had.

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Monday, April 10, 2017

The Dynamics of Sibling Relationships

Are you in, or have you ever been had, a sexual or romantic relationship with a sibling? Are you aware of someone who is or has been?

Throughout history, all over the world, regardless of class or other demographics, siblings have done everything from engaged in childhood exploration to having lifelong spousal relationships with each other, but myths about these relationships persist. In a study in the 1970s, ten percent of anonymous college-aged respondents indicated that they had already had consensual sexual contact with a sibling. As they age and have more opportunities, the percentage of sibling who've had sexual contact can only rise. You know people who've been involved, whether you know it or not.

While many places have laws against siblings sharing sex and it is labeled in many places as a taboo, there is clearly a fascination with such relationships that is widespread. some media depictions, such as in the Game of Thrones television series, are very popular and considered by many to be tantalizing. Siblings have been getting together in our stories as long as we've been telling stories, whether those stories have been erotica or not.

What makes people siblings? Genetically, siblings are people who share at least one genetic parent. Sharing one makes them half-siblings. Sharing both would make them full siblings. People can also be siblings by affinity, such as stepsiblings, meaning that each has a parent who married each other, or they were adopted by one or both common parents, or even that that genetically unrelated embryos were donated to and implanted in the same woman. Socially, people can informally be siblings through longtime cohabitation during childhood, even though no formal adoption or marriage legally links them.

Genetic siblings are often, but not always, raised together. Full and half siblings can grow up separately due to age, parental breakups and custody agreements, cuckolding, gamete or embryo donation, adoption, even deportation. For example, a couple might have their first child together at 19 and their last child together at 39. Those children will be full blood siblings, but will be 20 years apart in age, and it could be that the elder sibling has moved away before the youngest is even born. Embryos donated to different parents can be full siblings, raised apart. There are many scenarios in which half siblings are raised apart.


How It Happens



When genetic siblings, whether half or full, are not raised together (having minimal, if any contact from age 7 into puberty), what we call the Westermarck Effect ("Yuck! I can't imagine being with my brother!") is not present. This means there is a significant chance that if they meet or are reunited and their genders and sexual orientations are compatible, there is about a 50% chance at least one of them will experience reunion GSA, whether they are aware of their relation or not. Stepsiblings not raised together are also not going to have the Westermarck Effect and may experience an attraction, but there wouldn't be a genetic component to it in the same way as genetic siblings would have.

Siblings raised together, whether genetically related or not (stepsbilings and adopted siblings may not be closely related), will likely experience the Westermarck Effect, but they might not.

Whether the Westermarck Effect will be present or not, siblings close in age and living together often engage in childhood exploration or experimentation, such as "playing doctor" or "playing house" or "show me yours and I'll show you mine." That is often a matter of proximity, trust, and convenience, as it can be when adolescent siblings do thinks like masturbate in front of each other or engage in sexual acts with each other. When the Westermarck Effect is not present, siblings are much  more likely to engage in siblings-with-benefits arrangements, flings, or ongoing affairs or romances, from puberty throughout life.

Reunion GSA can happen any time from puberty onward as people seek our genetic relatives or encounter them even if they weren't aware they existed.

As for siblings raised together, sometimes things start in childhood or adolescence and continue, even if off an on. Wrestling with each other, teasing, dares, games, and even double dating can lead to more. Especially when and where adolescent sexuality was shamed, nobody would get a "reputation" if they were getting their curiosities and urges satisfied in their own home.

Some might initiate a new dimension to their relationship as adults. Often, but not always, some significant family event creates the conditions that foster this. Siblings might move in together for financial or security reasons or into an inherited home, or to care for an aging or ailing parent or sibling or for one another. Weddings, breakups, divorces, loss of employment, new employment in the same city as a sibling, funerals, family reunions, and other events can bring siblings together in a situation where new opportunities are presented and old crushes are reconsidered. It doesn't always have to be like that; it could be simply that the siblings spend time together and end up doing what comes naturally to them.

Adult siblings have always been able to live together with the blessing of family, neighbors, and the wider culture, whether young, middle aged, or elderly. In some cultures it has been expected that a woman (especially with her father deceased) live in her brother's home until she legally marries.

It shouldn't be surprising that where there is no Westermarck Effect or it is weak, siblings may get together. Studies have shown that most people are attracted to people who look like them, and who looks more like you than a genetic sibling? They may also look and behave like your parent, and the idea that we look for mates like our parent(s) could also be a factor. Even with stepsiblings comes the consideration that we are our parent's child, and our parent was attracted to their parent, so it shouldn't be surprising if we are attracted to a stepsibling.

Reunited siblings might not even see each other as siblings. But for others, there is an existing bond, trust, and usually opportunities and convenience that can be a very strong mix to foster a sexual dimension to their relationship. Those things can be so strong even in adolescence that siblings might experiment with (or at least in front of) each other against their sexual orientation.



Latency

Although many people express disgust at the idea of people they don't even know being sibling lovers, a common fantasy of many people is to have a sexual threesome with twins or other siblings; this involves incestuous aspects, whether the person having the fantasy recognizes that or not. Certainly not always, but sometimes, crushes for a sibling's friend or dating/hooking up with that sibling's friend is a "safe" redirection of what is actually a desire for a sibling, as can be dating/hooking up with someone who closely resembles a sibling. Dislike of a sibling's dates or lovers can be (but isn't always, of course) rooted in the desire to have that sibling to themselves. Dreams of having a sex with or marrying a sibling may be symbolic of something else entirely, or may be an indication of latent desires or attractions.


Affairs

Due to bigotry, often codified in laws criminalizing their love, most siblings keep their relationships somewhat closeted. A desire to have a family or pressure to marry (or stay married) can mean the siblings are with others ("beards") as spouses, and sometimes those spouses are not informed and consenting to the sibling relationship. Others are aware, and polyamory may be involved, even if it is secret to those outside of the relationships.

Where an affair is being carried on behind a spouse's back, suspicion may be avoided because many people don't think that their spouse would have sex with their sibling. Even if a baby is born from such an affair, it isn't suspicious for the baby to look like one parent and that parent's family but not so much the other parent.





The Results

Some siblings experiment a few times and that's that. Nothing more results.

At the other end of the spectrum is a very powerful connection between them to the point that no other relationship could compare or satisfy on the same level.

In between, there many possibilities, including ongoing "siblings-with-benefits."

There are a couple of countries that will legally marry half siblings, and some countries will allow siblings to be together even as the aren't allowed to marry, but there's much hostility facing siblings lovers.

Just as siblings might get together for the same reasons others get together, consanguinamorous relationships between siblings often have the same difficulties as other relationships, such as quarrels and disagreements, conflicting goals and priorities, jealousy and insecurity. Sometimes, the sexual part of the relationship or even the whole relationship ends.

Unfortunately, getting effective relationship counseling or therapy often isn't an option because of criminalization and a lack of research. Medical care may also be hindered for the same reasons, especially for any children they have together, and since siblings (with the exception of half siblings in a couple of countries) aren't allowed to legally marry, it can mean an estranged parent makes medical decisions for one when the person who is their spouse in every way except under the law isn't allowed.

In addition to the threat of imprisonment in many places, consanguinamorous siblings face discrimination in the workplace and housing, and may lose custody of their children (including children from other relationships) simply because they love each other. Strangely, some people insist that a woman is capable of consenting to go to war, but not to consent to a relationship with a brother or sister. Prejudices often extend to stepsiblings.

Since laws have often assumed heterosexuality, there may be laws in some places, including some US states, where it is now technically legal for same-sex siblings to have sex and marry. Existing laws have intended to deny siblings the right to marry or even be together, but antigay laws that have since been removed used to already prohibit same-sex relationships. If you want to look into this, consult a lawyer (especially a criminal defense or family law attorney) where you live.

These lovers might find it helpful to move where nobody knows of their relation. If they are genetic siblings, having children together can still expose their secret due to DNA tests, and as long as someone from back home hasn't sent a private investigator to follow them, they may find they have the freedom to do simple things like walk hand-in-hand in public and share a quick kiss.

Whether or not sibling lovers move away from family and friends, if they share one or both parents, they are likely to have less extended family than lovers who aren't as closely related.

Siblings who are not involved in the relationship might be envious, or might fear the backlash of bigotry should others come to know about the relationship. On the other hand, polyamorous relationships can and do happen between siblings, even with people who might not be polyamorous in other situations. Parents of involved siblings or children of involved siblings might also have concerns about what will happen should others come to know of the relationship, and many people in such situations don't like to think of their children (no matter how old) or their parents as sexual beings in the first place. Family members may be hostile, even ratting out the lovers to authorities. It's commendable when they are, instead, accepting and supporting, but sometimes all the lovers can hope for is a "don't ask, don't tell" policy in which their family won't interfere as long as things are kept discreet and/or unsaid.

Although these relationships do face much prejudice, socially and legally they are more accepted than intergenerational consanguinamory.

While there are risks and some challenges (mostly due to prejudice), there can be strong benefits to having a romantic and/or sexual relationship with someone with whom one already has so much in common.

In addition to the usual reasons romantic/sexual relationships end, such as incompatibility, some of these relationships drop this form of intimacy because of the bigotry faced ("I want to get married and have a family, and I can't do that with my sibling"), which is a real shame. Some siblings hate each other; it's too bad that siblings who love each other so much would be in any way restrained.



The Way Forward

It should be up to the individuals involved as to whether or not they enter into, or persist, in a romantic or sexual relationship.

Laws and prejudices against these relationships must be changed, and changed sooner rather than later, as people are suffering for no good reason. Lovers, friends, family, and allies should help to make this happen. This will allow more serious research to be conducted, which will make things better for everyone.

In the meantime, lovers should consider what they need to do to protect themselves and each other, and their allies should assist them in those things.


Consenting adults may do things with each other that might disgust a majority of other adults, but that disgust of others should not prevent the consenting adults from having their sex or love lives. Each of us should stand up for the relationship rights of all consenting adults. The disgusted person is free to not have such relationships, but should recognize that other adults should be free to have orientations, feelings, and relationships they may not understand, and free to express their sexual desires with, and affections for, other consenting adults in the ways they want.

There is no good reason that siblings who are consenting adults should be denied their right to be together however they mutually agree.


Some Exclusive Interviews with Siblings

Consanguinamory


From Russia With Love (Sister Raising Four Children with Her Genetic Full Brother)

Third Time is the Charm
(Genetic Half Brother and Sister)

The Family Values of Lifelong Love (Brother and Sister, their daughter also gives her perspective)

A Same-Sex Marriage Still Denied
(Male Identical Twins)

In Double-Love But Denied the Right to Marry (Brother and Sister)

A Woman Denied the Right to Marry the Person She Loves (Genetic Half Sister and Brother)

A Slowly Simmered Love (Genetic Half Brother and Sister)

They Would Marry Today If They Could (Genetic Half Brother and Sister)

Building a Family, But Denied the Right to Marry (Genetic Half Brother and Sister)

A burning love denied marriage equality (Genetic Half Brother and Sister)


Genetic Sexual Attraction Sparks an Intense Love (Genetic Half Brother and Sister)

A sister married to her brother in every way but under the law

A brother whose lifelong lover is his twin sister

A man whose husband is his brother

A polyamorous bisexual woman who'd marry her twin brother

A sister who would marry her brother

A brother whose brother is his husband in every way except by law

Another sister married to her brother in every way but under the law.


A Young Woman Denied Her Rights (Genetic Half Brother and Sister)

Another Loving Couple Denied Their Freedom to Marry (Brother and Sister)

Two Women Still Denied Their Right to Marry (Sisters)

Australian Couple Denied Their Freedom to Marry (Genetic Brother and Sister)

A Young Adult Love in Hiding (Brother and Sister)

A Brother Tells of His Marriage to His Sister

Very Happy Together But Denied the Freedom to Marry (Half Brother and Sister)

A Lifelong Love Denied Marriage Equality (Brother and Sister)

Another Marriage Denied Equality Under the Law (Brother and Sister)

A Beautiful Woman Denied the Right to Marry the Father of Her Children (Brother and Sister)

Kevin and Donna (Brother and Sister)


Interviews By Others

The Final Manifesto published an interview with a woman who wants to marry the father of his child, who is her brother.

Jane has an interview with a woman who is with her brother.



Adopted Siblings

A woman who is married to her adopted brother in every way except under the law.



Polyamorous Consanguinamory

A Bisexual Woman Denied Her Rights (A Triad with Male Twins)

Two Women Still Denied Their Right to Marry (Genetic Half-Sisters)

A mother, her son, and her daughter who want to marry

A young man in a polycule with his mother and sisters

A Pansexual Woman Denied Her Rights

A Unicorn Makes Three (A Woman with Her Sister and Son)




If you've been in such a relationship or know someone who has as you would like to be interviewed, I'd like to interview you. Contact me at fullmarriageequality at protonmail dot com.

If you are looking for help, see this page.

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Siblings Day

It’s national Siblings Day, at least here in the US. 

In keeping with the interests of this blog, we want to celebrate all people who love their siblings, especially if that includes supporting your sibling as they face discrimination for their gender identity, their sexual or relationship orientations, or their relationships or sexuality. We also want to celebrate all siblings in consanguinamorous relationships. For many of them, there is no more important person in the world than their sibling(s).

So if you have a good sibling, let them know you appreciate them.


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Sorting Out Relation

Sometimes people, especially young people, aren't certain of how to describe their relation to someone else. It doesn't help that legal relation isn't always the same as genetic (blood) relation.  People can legally be siblings, but not be close genetic relatives, for example. Or two people can be genetic siblings but not legal relatives. Relation by blood/genetics is referred to as consanguinity and relation by marriage or law is may be referred to as affinity.

Generally, the law recognizes that people are related through birth*, adoption, or marriage (or civil union or domestic partnership.)

I hope this provides clarity to people who are uncertain.



Cousins: This is explained in detail here, so I will just be brief and say that your parent's sibling's child is your first cousin. Your first cousin's child is your first cousin, once removed. Your child would be a second cousin to your first cousin, once removed. Also, your first cousin is your child's first cousin, once removed.



Full sibling: A brother or sister whose biological/genetic parents are the same as yours.

Half sibling: A brother or sister who shares one, not two, biological/genetic parents with you. Because people can have half-siblings, they can also have half-uncles, half-aunts, half-cousins, half-nieces, and half-nephews. For example, your parent has a half-brother. He would be your half-uncle (although many people choose to simply say "uncle".) Note that someone can have two half-siblings who are not closely related to each other genetically.


Adopted/Adoptive: When legal arrangements were made to become legally recognized family, which otherwise happens through marriage or birth*. For example, if your parents adopted an orphaned boy, he would be your adopted brother and would be legally as much your parents' child as you. Or you could both be adopted by the same parents. It isn't just minor children who are adopted. Adults have adopted other adults.


Stepsibling, Stepbrother, Stepsister, Stepparent, Stepmother, Stepfather, Stepchild, Stepson Stepdaughter: A relation through marriage and is usually someone who is not a close biological relative. Someone is your stepsibling/-brother/-sister because their parent married your parent. Your stepsibling is the child of your stepparent. Someone is your stepparent/-father/-mother because they married your parent. Someone is your stepchild/-son/-daughter because you married their parent. For some purposes in some places, some laws treat steprelations like biological/genetic or adoptive relations. Sometimes, a steprelation becomes an adoptive relation, such as when a stepparent adopts their stepchild.



In-law: Someone who is related to you by marriage or custom (but usually this person is not a steprelation) and may be recognized as such by law or socially. The parents of your spouse would be your mother-in-law or father-in-law. Your spouse's siblings would be your brother-in-law or sister-in-law.  Your sibling's spouse would also be your sister-in-law or brother-in-law. Your child's spouse would be your daughter-in-law or son-in-law.



People generally refer to other people by their closest relation. For example, if you married a second cousin, you would generally call them your spouse, not your second cousin, as spouses are legally next-of-kin and second cousins rarely are (all closer relations would have to be deceased). Or, if your parents adopted your cousin, it would be customary to call your cousin your sibling.


*The term "birth" is often used in place of "genetic" or "genetics" but it should be noted that:

1) Surrogate mothers often give birth to children to whom they have no close genetic relation, and they will not be the legal mother of that child.

2) Some women give birth to, and raise, and are the presumed and legal mother of children to whom they are not closely genetically related because the child was conceived using a donor egg or was a donated embryo.

3) In many places, parental designation (such as paternity) is automatically assigned under the law to a spouse of the woman who birthed the child even when the child has no close genetic relation to this "birth father/parent" because the child was a donated embryo or conceived by sperm donation, or sexual intercourse with someone outside the legal marriage, regardless of whether or not the sexual intercourse was something this spouse knew about.






More terms used frequently on this blog are explained here.



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Sunday, April 9, 2017

Cornmeal Idlis



Have you ever thought of making idlis using cornmeal? Yes, it is possible and is absolutely delicious! It is especially useful if you have not soaked your lentils for regular idlis and want to make idlis next day for breakfast. These idlis can also be made instantaneously without any fermentation! How cool is that??



You can make it with or without adding any vegetables into it. I like to add some peas and carrots into the batter . Some people also use chopped green chillies and grated ginger. I don't like that in my idlis. I would rather pair it with a spicy chutney. Also, I want my kids to eat this and they don't like it if there are chillies in it.



This is a easy recipe wherein there is no grinding involved. Yogurt/curd is used to make the batter. A pinch of baking soda is added. The batter is allowed to ferment for 2-3 hours. I like to make mine at night and leave it on the countertop, ready to be steamed in the morning. If you want to make it instantaneously, use eno fruit salt instead of baking soda.



Servings: makes 16 medium sized idlis


Prep time: 15 mins + 2 hours fermentation

Cook time: 10-15 mins

Total time: 2 and 1/2 hours including fermentation time.


Ingredients:


Cornmeal: 1 cup
Yogurt: 1 cup
Water: 1/2 cup ( may not need all)
Baking soda: a pinch ( optional)
Salt to taste
Coconut oil: 1 tsp + for greasing the pan.
Mustard seeds: 1/2 tsp
Curry leaves: 1 sprig
Urad dal (split matpe beans): 1/2tsp
Chana dal ( split chick peas): 1 tsp
Cashew halves: 1 tbsp

Method:


Dry roast the cornmeal in a sauté pan  it in a plate/ bowl and keep aside.

In a saute pan, heat oil . Add mustard seeds. Once the mustard seeds splutter, add the urad dal,chana dal curry leaves and cashew halves.Sauté for few seconds. Add the cornmeal.
Roast on low heat until fragrant( around 5-6 minutes). Turn off the flame. Let it cool down.

Take this mixture in a bowl. When cooled down, add the cooked peas and carrots, salt, baking soda and yogurt. Mix thoroughly.


 Add the water little by little, mixing well in between until you reach the consistency of idli batter.

Let if ferment for atleast 2 hours.

When you are ready to cook the idlis, grease the idli mold with ghee/ butter fill it with batter until 2/3 full and steam in the idli steamer / pressure cooker ( without using the weight) for 10 minutes on medium- high flame.Turn off the heat and let it cool down in the steamer for another 10 minutes before taking them out of the mold.

Serve hot with sambar/ chutney or both.

Enjoy!

Cooking made easy:


To make these idlis instantaneously, just add eno into the batter instead of baking soda. Make the batter and steam it immediately. When eno is added to the batter, the batter should not be kept for a long time. It loses its ability to rise.

Tip for healthy living:


Incorporating as many vegetables into all your meals not only provides you with the essential nutrients and dietary fiber, but also reduces the calorie value of the meal thereby making it healthier.

Food for thought:

Listening, not imitation, may be the sincerest form of flattery. Joyce Brothers


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Saturday, April 8, 2017

Documentary on Reunion GSA in Siblings

These GSA documentaries seem to pop up and then go away, so hopefully this one remains available again for at least a while.



There are comments on YouTube, and some are good.

Just in case the embedded video disappears (because Google seems to have a problem with their Blogger keeping their YouTube videos embedded), here's the link.

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Frequently Asked Question: Why Do Polyamorists Get Married?


The question is asked as though the person asking assumes that actual monogamy is a requirement for marriage. It isn’t in most places, even though current marriage laws will only allow monogamy in the legal sense.

For the purpose of this question and answer, I will include any form of honest nonmonogamy, or any label applied, such as open relationship, open marriage, swinging, swapping, polyamory, polyfidelity and polygamy.

Why do swingers get married?

Why do people in open relationships get married?

Why do polyamorous people get married?

The short answer is: For the same reason most other people get married. They want to get married, they think it is the best thing to do at that time in life, or they’re pressured.



There are many reasons to get married, and as I noted, one doesn’t actually need to be monogamous to get married, unless one wants to be ethical and married to someone who needs and demands monogamy. People get married for love, for attraction, for companionship, to solemnize or make official their relationship, for religious reasons, to make a public statement, for sex, for children, for friendship, for benefits, for insurance, to pool resources, to co-parent, for career, for money, as a form of commitment, to apply a legal structure to their relationship, and for other reasons I’m probably forgetting. Nonmonogamists who marry do so for one or more of these reasons, just like anyone else.

Some people cite the marriage vow of "forsaking all others." But that is just ONE vow, not one that all people marrying make. The vow can also mean different things to different marriages.

Some nonmonogamists decline to marry for various reasons. Some, like some monogamists, have decided to decline until everyone can get married. Some decline to marry until everyone in their polycule can marry. Some can’t have a legal marriage for their polycule until there is full marriage equality.

The question can also be asked of monogamists: Why do you get married? Not only is actual monogamy not a requirement, in many places, of our restrictive marriage laws, but one can be monogamous without being married.


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